My comments to the over-reaction/assumption of some

[Don H]

Let me forst say DWI is a dangerous situation...but.... I am re-posting this one on its own from the "Bad News" Top[ic...int hat no one knows anothers condition..so this was my comment to what I thought was some over-reaction:

I too am concerned. But no one here ever had a six pack plus two???

Concern is one thing...but all of this psycho-analysis???

I don't agree with it at all.No one knows Eric's condition. So I would say wish him well. That's all!

--------------------

Loving Raspberries In The 21st Century!

[hollies65]

I've had plenty to drink on many occasions...about 25 years ago I made it a point not to drive a car when I did that. So to answer your question...Yes I have had a couple of six packs [it's been 20 years since I've done that in one evening]

And..NO...I have not had a couple of DUI's.

[anita cottino]

Don H, I agree with you. We should not judge another human being's behaviour? There are so many (personal) reasons someone can deviate from their regular path!...

What Eric needs is support and encouragements for a better time ahead. I believe my comments in the "Bad News" topic reflected just that and I sincerely hope Eric will eventually read all these encouragements notes addressed to him.

Anita

[MJ]

I have had way more than a 6 pack plus 2 - but then I grew up. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

[Tony Cartmill]

Anita's obviuosly a Democrat...

Look, I can't stop posting. I have an internet addiction. I don't have a life. Don't judge me. Don't get offended. Don't demand I show some discipline and tone it down. Who are you all to cast judgement on me? Why can't you just tolerate and embrace our rude blow-hard styles of expressing our opinions, in the true loving liberal diversity-is-king way?...

Until we get the truth from Eric himself, I'm gonna' continue to Blah, Blah, Blah on the topic now and then...SO DEAL WITH IT!

[darlene]

Don, what a great post. Like Anita, I completely agree. I also think that Anita's post and those of everyone else were made in love and support.

We're quite a family here at EC.com and we're very passionate about Eric, Raspberries and the music. And it follows that our posts get passionate, and all of them, including mine, sometimes get carried away.

I too would favor the "isolated incident/could happen to any of us" side.

As for Tony, Aunt Antonietta's errant nephew, he getta outta hand a lotta the time, but he-a such a good boy. Antonio, you gotta-a-life! You change-a the diapers, you provide-a for-a you familia, you a VERY good boy.

So, you getta carried away with-a you mouth now and-a then. You can't-a help it. You a Republican on-a your soapbox. You get it from-a my side of the familia. --Love, Aunt Antonietta

--Darlene

[ColoradoGal]

Why does E need support and encouragement, support of what and encouragement to do what? I don't give a rats patoot if anyone wants to sit around and get gassed at home/bar/whereever, THE PROBLEM IS he got behind the wheel of a car and drove very impaired and if having an open bottle on the front seat indicates anything, he was still drinking as he was driving. He has to take responsibility for that!

[JuliaD]

Up to this point, I've stayed silent on this, partly due to the fact I don't get here every day and didn't know about it till Friday night, and partly out of respect for Eric. I don't believe anyone here who knows me would ever question that Eric is tops in my book.

There was QUITE a thread a few years back that someone started about Eric's smoking... they said they wish he'd stop, it's bad for him, and so on. I stood up for Eric, by saying he's an adult, he knows the dangers, and if he wants to continue smoking despite the dangers, that's his business. People "informed" me his smoking harms others via second hand smoke, so it's not just himself he's harming.

Now we see two DUI arrests in 18 months. As much as I'd love to do otherwise, I can't see that as anything but a negative. We all saw the video. Is there one person here, who, if they were on a WalMart parking lot, and saw someone stagger like that and get behind the wheel and onto the highway, would not phone the police? Would you want someone that impaired driving thru the neighborhood your kids are playing in?

I'm sorry, but this was a really dangerous thing to do. If someone wants to drink a lot, no problem, but DO NOT drive, period. Someone, even Eric, could have been killed or maimed for life.

I'm not disrespecting Eric, I love the guy, and I hope he manages to sort out and deal with *this*, whatever *this is, and I wish him the best.

[Art]

Correct, Coloradogal. I do not know what would be an over-reaction to this episode....it is just such a very serious error in judgement and this Russian Roulette needs to be faced up to immediately and completely. Eric has always been my hero, and I trust he will get it together.

[Trindy]

If there is a problem with our attitude toward drunk driving in this society, it is that we are TOO tolerant. We are TOO accepting. We are TOO reluctant to judge. We are TOO willing to say "There but for the grace of God go I."

Indeed, many people have "had a six pack plus two" and then gone out to drive. And those of us who like to pride ourselves on our fairness hate to condemn others for what we know we ourselves have done.

So, as individuals, we are lenient and tolerant and understanding...and because we are lenient and tolerant and understanding, people get maimed, and people die. Injury and death are the steep price we pay for our sense of fair play and our "reluctance to pass judgment on others."

I will say it: as a society, this is one area in which we need to be LESS tolerant, LESS accepting, MORE judgmental. On ourselves as well as on other people.

We need to say: "No, I never HAVE 'had a six pack plus two'--or, if I did, I didn't climb behind the wheel after I had them." Or "Yes, I have--but it was damn stupid of me, and I was damn lucky, and I will never do it again, and no one else should."

This is one area of life in which it's OK to pass judgment, OK to be prudish and stick-up-the-ass and intolerant. Not of the person as a human being, but of the BEHAVIOR.

Until we as a society become MORE willing to be judgmental about drunk driving, we will continue to pay the price in the form of unnecessary injury and death.

We need to stop saying "There but for the grace of God go I" about the drunk driver, and start putting ourselves in the shoes of his passengers, and in the shoes of the other people he encounters on the road when he knows he has been drinking, but they don't. There but for the grace of God go we.

Maybe if we tried harder to identify with the innocent victim, instead of thinking so much about how that drunk driver could have been us and how awful we'd feel if we got caught, we'd feel freer to be judgmental.

[mellie]

A few abstract thoughts that I've been having after reading these posts ~

Is it possible to

- be discerning without being judgmental?

- express anger without attacking?

- be compassionate and respectful without enabling?

Eric's music and lyrics express love, loss, joy, sadness, romance, pain... He had to experience the extremes of desperation and exhilaration to write about it in ways that relate to so many. For whatever reason, he's hurting. I don't know what caused the pain. It is obviously deeper than I can understand. A lot of people are feeling very heavy hearts right now. I keep thinking - listen to the music and you'll find your way back to who you are. Just listen to the music.

Now, if that makes sense to someone, would you please explain it to me???

[Muzza]

Makes sense to me but I ain't explaining it as I suspect it will make sense in different ways to each of us. Great Post Mellie.

Muzza

[Brian]

His brother entered a "Not Guilty" plea....http://www.wkyc.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=96695

[Tony Cartmill]

ENABLING - Knowing you have a smart laywer always there for you...your brother.

[raspathens]

Eric's brother doesn't normally practice criminal law. He just entered a plea on Eric's behalf. Enabling? Jeeeez.

Eric is in serious trouble just based on the bare facts of this case. I am glad that he will get good representation. Did it ever occur to you that his notoriety might work against him?

[Tony Cartmill]

Good point! The more the police videos get shown on the web, the harder it will be this time to no-contest this dust-bunny under the rug...

[raspathens]

Tony : The sentence on the first one was about right. The lawyer couldn't do anything with the first video. He won't be able to do anything with this one. What's he going to do, argue that the breathalizer gave a false positive and what we saw on the video was really just a street-art performance? You think we're magicians?

[Tony Cartmill]

No, no, no, Magicians have a conscience... :p

[raspathens]

:p :p

[Tony Cartmill]

What I mean is:

1. Fact: Eric is on the video mentioning his brother more than once, trying to get a favor with his connections. I would have probably done the same thing...

2. Fact: With a widely seen video and publicity, a judge, DA and the defense attorney are under scrutiny NOT to make some little deal to let the perp off easy, as compared to the average quiet "DUI Donny the Hydrant Dodger" case with no injuries.

You know how some judges like to legislate from the bench and lessen sentences when no one is watching...

So why does Lawyer Boy talk like I'm way off base?

[Betsey]

For God's sake!!! What is wrong with Fred helping Eric out in his time of need? I, too, have an attorney brother and believe me, he has helped out many family members with several different issues. Isn't that what family is for? I am glad that Fred is there for Eric now.

[Betsey]

And by the way, Tony, I have enjoyed your humorous posts over the years, but I disagree with you on this one. I do not believe we are entitled to "the truth from Eric himself" as you say. Don't you think he's in enough agony right now, without worrying about "fessing up" to us? He knows we adore him and his music and he also knows what he did is wrong, as we all do. Let him deal with this with some privacy and dignity for the sake of his family.

[Tony Cartmill]

Good advice Betsey, But blowhards like me find it difficult not to speculate with so much time on our hands. I'd still like to hear from Eric on the subject, even if I don't have the right to ask...

[BEATNUT]

I remember watching a movie on TV. It had to do with a drunk driver killing someone.

The driver was very remorseful. The family forgave him and they didn't even know him. He did not have to do any jail time, but only under this condition.

He had to write a check to the family for ONE DOLLAR on the first of the month every single month for the rest of his life, or he would have to go to jail. Even if it got there 1 day late. The mother of the victim wanted to make sure that the driver NEVER forgot what he had done. The more the years passed, the more difficult it became to write the checks. Does anyone remember that movie?

Anyway, Eric's notoriety may work against him, but if he does the RIGHT thing it can also work for him. He hasn't killed anyone or himself yet in his path of self destruction. That in itself is a blessing. Hopefully Eric will see this and decide to do something constructive with his THIRD chance. Eric will remain in my prayers.

I love him that much.

[Bob Allen]

You Eric Carmen fans need to get a life (as they say).