ira Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Rock and Roll is surely the people's music..and I've always enjoyed the "Garage Band" element of songs like "Expressway To Your Heart","96 Tears","I Fought The Law", etc.But I love good poetry...and I wanted to take a minute to praise the lyricism of one "E. Carmen".The sheer lyrical beauty of "Desperate Fools","She Remembered","The Way We Used To Be","I'm Through With Love" ("Can't take the lows...don't want those highs"...) etc. etc. etc..... never fail to thrill me ad-infinitum.I'm no art afficianado...but I imagine that the way people look at a Van Gogh and see something new every time..is similar to the way I can listen to "She Remembered" over and over...and never fail to find a new shade of meaning each time.Life is empty without passions...and Eric's music AND poetry make everyone a little bit more passionate and loving.Thanks Mr.C. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 You're so spot on, I can't add muh more.When I was finishing up some unfinished business for my final year of high school English, the course was mostly poetry, and he hits most of the styles and fits most of the requirements of appeal to emotion, meter, rhyme and symbollism for me.It was only when I read the lyrics I knew just how gifted a poet he is!Right on, EC! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnniekNY Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Amen, Ira! Prettymom, I actually brought in eric's poetry to creative writing class in college!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Cartmill Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 One wonders why, since the late 80's, why genius word man Eric doesn't like to write lyrics solo anymore. Did he ever explain why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy K. Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 And it is interesting that you mention this, Tony. I never thought about this before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darlene Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 How absolutely true, Ira. I remember playing Jake Holmes' album, "So Close, So Very Far To Go" for a fifth grade teacher friend of mine, who was a literary buff, and as she was reading the lyrics, she said, "He's a poet, and he just sets his poems to music." She adored that.Later, I thought the exact same of Eric's writing. Just by reading his posts, one can see his extremely impressive command of the English language and I'm sure he was precocious, and an absolute genius even as a child. He puts words together in his head on a level way above most of the people on this planet. It's just a natural talent with him. His lyrics are naturally amazing. It's no surprise that they reflect an artistry far beyond what most lyricists write.I think Bernie once said that Eric agonizes over lyrics to express his music as perfectly as he can, and it's a very arduous process that he would rather avoid. Its that "perfection is consuming" thing, but perfectionists don't realize that their worst work is so far above anyone else's best, that they always produce an amazing product.That said, the perfectionist will always want his/her art to be perfect in his/her own eyes, and I guess that's part of the artistry.At any rate, I hope Eric writes new material and does his own lyrics, because there's no marriage under the sun better than that of the music and lyrics in all of EC's work. --Darlene Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Carmen Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 I promise , if I write something new, I'll write the lyrics. The truth is, the "Boats Against The Current" album killed me when Clive didn't really hear it or promote it. I poured so much of myself into that recording that I found it hard to commit myself so completely to a project thereafter. After spending days to get just one line that was right, the lack of success of "Boats" was so discouraging, it made it hard for me to spend the amount of time and effort necessary to write that calibre of song again. If and when I do, it will be for love of the craft, not success, in the future.ec Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marvin Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Good to hear Eric. With all due resepect, Dean Pitchford and all those other co-writers ain't got nothing on you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 "Never Give Up" because someone didn't appreciate something you did. It's them. Not you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canadianchick Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 If and when you do Eric, we will buy it up right away...and it will be because of our admiration for your poetry/music....and your love of your craft... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna R Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 "Boats" is and always will be in my opinion, anabsolute masterpiece.I have never found another album that even comes close to the sheer brilliance of lyric and music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Darn right!EC needs a shot of ego boost! And the nutjob who dismissed the thing needs a whack in the butt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Anna R wrote:"Boats" is and always will be in my opinion, an absolute masterpiece. I have never found another album that even comes close to the sheer brilliance of lyric and music.Amen, Anna.Boats will always be my favorite song AND album. It's perfection from start to finish. For 30 years it's driven me crazy that BATC never received the acclaim that it deserves...I can't imagine Eric's frustration. And it's not just Boats...all of EC's albums are filled with masterpieces. As Darlene said, "there's no marriage under the sun better than that of the music and lyrics in all of EC's work". Selfishly, I hope he writes more music, but if Eric never writes another word it's OK with me. With a wife and young children (and previous frustrations), I can fully understand if Eric doesn't want to dedicate the time and effort it would take to write new material (that would be up to HIS standards). Even though we'll always want more, Eric Carmen has already given us more than enough great music. There's so many great EC songs that I'll never tire of. Like Ira said, it's almost like hearing new music each time you listen to them. Even though Eric said, "the lack of success of "Boats" was so discouraging", I hope he understands that to the people that do "get it", that album means the world (we like his other stuff a little bit too). That's why I love this site...it's full of people who "get it".DuaneGreat thread Ira...great posts by everybody. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMan Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 I have to agree with all that's been said above. "Boats is definitely my favorite Eric album...I remember that it made a huge impact on this kid from Jersey way back in '77. And it still does to this day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raspbernie Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 BOATS AGAINST THE CURRENT is a masterpiece. Nothing that came before it and nothing that has come since has affected me the way that album has. Nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Cartmill Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Which brings up the need for the 9th song from the "Boats..." album, "Temporary Hero" to be recorded and included on the next CD, with "Cindy, Devil, Wild,..." The CD is already half written.Trust me! Those four songs are first-rate EC compositions and it's a crime for them to be left on the cutting-room floor.We can help Eric "get over" that lost Dave Wintour bass track recording on "Temporary Hero".I'm pretty sure the song can survive with something similar... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna R Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Which brings up the need for the 9th song from the "Boats..." album, "Temporary Hero" to be recorded and included on the next CD, with "Cindy, Devil, Wild,..." The CD is already half written. Couldn't agree more Tony! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okstevens Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 It's funny, here at ec.com we get it.For years I didn't think anyone heard it the same way I did. This is why this site is so damned good.(Thanks Bernie) I don't know about everyone else, but I have plenty of friends who don't 'get it'. Eric, Boats killed us too but I mean it in a great way. Please don't think it is not artistically appreciated. Above all please do not let it get in the way of taking the time and effort for another master piece such as Boats. It reminds me of the Woody Harrelson Wesley Snipes movie " White Men Can't Jump" where Wesley tells Woody "You Can't Hear Jimmy" (Hendricks) It instantly had me think that there just may be people who don't 'hear' the Berries or EC the way I, we, do... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darlene Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 A major point in the Clive Davis saga concerning "Boats" is, that if Clive were all that talented, he would have *written* "Boats" (and a host of other great music) rather than trying to tell the composer what and how to write. Maybe he was great at predicting who would/could be a star and good at hand-picking real talent, but he obviously didn't have a phenomenal amount of *musical* talent because he just didn't get it.How often it is that those in positions of power lack talent and vision but can and do use their positions to strong-arm and discourage those with creative genius. Take the opinions of the "powers that be" such as Mr. Davis with more than one grain of salt. Like I said, if he really KNEW, he'd be writing the stuff instead of cashing in on the talents of his artists. I'll bet Clive has been wrong way many more times than he's been right in his career. He was so far wrong about "Boats" that his "discouraging" opinion is totally meaningless. --Darlene Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ira Posted March 6, 2008 Author Share Posted March 6, 2008 There is no doubt that Eric Carmen is a major talent and that in a fair world would have been even MORE successful.Yet when I spoke to him in Cleveland in December and mentioned that Jennifer Lee has all the goods..she should be a bigger star...Eric said "It's a tough business and I feel lucky for having achieved the success I have achieved".After this conversation I was reminded of my favorite Hebrew saying.."Ay-ze hoo ashir ha-sameach b'chelko"..."The rich man is the one who is pleased with his lot in life".I got the sense that in his 50's..Eric is pleased to be comfortable with a good family and with a devoted following.Good for you Eric...That's a nice place to be.-Ira. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 I'll bet EC will eventually shrug it off and start up again.If I'm not satisfied with someone to whom I show my very best efforts, I just walk away. If someone insults my kids, I do the same thing. It's a matter of using the confidence one has to take your talent elsewhere --- to a someone who will see it as the good thing it is.I'm happy if he's satisfied right now, but still am looking forward to more, because "Cindy" and "Never Say Die" are in my files, and so are a few gems from "Boats". I'd never copy or sell thme!I think someone would bite now if Eric threw out the bait, seeing as people want that feeling bak again. And we are in the majority. The kids can have their turn later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darlene Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Like Eric said, he'll do it "for the love of the craft," and that's a huge love! One that even unwarranted criticism that has no validity can't extinguish. More music will come when it's time. --Darlene Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulie Mississippi Posted March 6, 2008 Share Posted March 6, 2008 Needless to say, but "love of the craft" might not be a bad title for the forthcoming album... And it's follow-up could be "love of the fans"... who will make sure it's not a total "loss"... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ira Posted March 8, 2008 Author Share Posted March 8, 2008 God...This has been such a rare opportunity for fans and artist to speak.Eric..Whatever you do in the future..."Thanks for the memories"-Ira. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HT from Mo Posted March 8, 2008 Share Posted March 8, 2008 Like Eric said, he'll do it "for the love of the craft," and that's a huge love! One that even unwarranted criticism that has no validity can't extinguish. More music will come when it's time. --Darlene I agree Darlene. Eric doesn't do any project whether it be a new solo album or Raspberries show half way or "good enough". It shows especially in "Boats" and "Live on Sunset Strip".HT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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