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My thoughts on Michael Jackson...


Raspbernie

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...after seeing his daughter Paris talking about how much she loved her Daddy:

What a selfish fool! I don't care if it was an accidental overdose, he made the decision to take those drugs. So much for Michael's love for children. Sorry, that's just how I'm seeing it right now. He was an exceptional talent, but what a selfish fool!

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Oh, man...Reverend Al and a well organized group of Accorn workers is going to be picketing Bernie's house tomorrow...

"...And WHY are all of these "Mr. Hogya's Milk Ads" ALWAYS with a WHITE milk mustache? In Mr. Hogya's world, doesn't anybody drink chocolate milk? Or is this just another racist ad campaign where a black man is forced into drinking what the white man tells him to drink?...

(Pssst! Mr. Hogya, a $100,000 check made out to "Reverend Al's Travelin' Race Baitin' Show" and all this goes away...Oh, and an apology to my good friend Michael as well...") eek

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Bernie, don't be sorry for calling it as you saw it at that moment. I, too, was moved when I saw Paris speak about her love for her Daddy. Before she parted her lips to speak, I cringed because she is a child who has just experienced the most traumatic event a child can go through. She and her brothers need a lot of time to heal and to accept that their world that was turned upside down, might never be turned right side up again. I hope that none of the kids will be put in the spotlight like that again. Grief is not a spectator sport! :yikes:

Well, Mike's love for children definately extended to his own, but was surpassed only by Mike's love for himself. crying

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I thought that Michael was awesome through the 1980's! It was so fitting that the circus was in town and was setting up immediately after Michael's tribute today. If not now, Michael was not long for this world - He was not going to be an 80 year old man sitting on his porch someday. I hope his kids can find a stable home in the future. I wouldn't mind seeing them taken in by Brooke Shields somewhere down the line.

There is quite an OD collection of characters gathering...Janis Joplin, Bon Scott, Phil Lynott, John Bonham, etc...and now MJ.

Tim

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I disagree. I don't think it's fair to question his love for his children because he took some sort of (possibly) prescribed seditive.

I'm not what I would consider a fan of his. I like a lot of songs ("Beat It", "Billie Jean", "She's Out Of My Life", "PYT", "I'll Be There", etc) but I wouldn't consider myself "a fan". I probably have too much loyalty to Paul McCartney with the issues over the Beatles catalogue for feeling that way and that's probably unfair, too, but it's just the way I feel.

I do have to say that this guy has been in the fishbowl of the press for basically his entire life and none of us can even imagine what it's like to have our childhood taken away from us and then not even be able to walk down the street without the fear that maybe someone is going to kidnap your kids or kill you. That would make anyone a little nutty, I'd guess, certainly paranoid. Even Elvis, Macca, Lennon, Madonna, Mariah, Mick, etc didn't have this insane pressure since they were ten years old, so I have to feel a little sorry for the guy.

Oh, I know, he had bazillions of dollars, but that's quite a price to pay for the money.

Now, I've never taken a drug or a drink in my life, and that statement and a dollar will get me on the bus, but maybe I would have if I had people following me on every step since I was ten, questioning my every move, lying about me to get extortion money, having my dad allegedly handcuff me to a radiator for singing a bad note, my picture in every newspaper in the country, etc.

I just don't think there was any question about his love for his kids. The guy walked away from even more success to spend every waking moment with those kids, just like Lennon did before his own untimely death.

I feel horrible for those kids. They have a mother who basically sold them and now their dad, who was always with them, is gone. That beautiful little girl just broke my heart when she fell apart up there and that was the most real moment of the whole memorial.

We might have lost a pop singer, dare I say a "legend", but she lost her daddy.

We'll never know what went into this guy's head every waking moment of his life, but it was pretty clear he loved those kids.

Just the way I feel.

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My sentiments exactly, Pat. This is hardly the first father who has made unwise choices in spite of having kids. He loved them and they knew that and that in itself is more than some kids will EVER know! The fact that they were willing to tell the entire world that they loved HIM should say enough in itself! I cannot fathom what I would have been like if I had been forced to live his life (which started out in an unnatural way thanks to his father.) And dare I say this, but.... why didn't his 'saintly' mother ever put a stop to the father and this insanity for the sake of her children?!?!

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You girls are right. If evil Joe was as bad as everybody says, Then saintly mother and older brothers should have done more to protect MJ during his formative years.

However, other than LaToya, the other Jackson siblings don't seem to have grown to be mental Freakshows, so Michael may have been just a mental case ready to bloom all along...

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Well, there is a difference as I perceive it (and this is just my opinion, nothing more.) All the weight was dumped on Michael. He was the youngest yet he was the most talented and the frontman. He carried the brunt of the show while with his brothers. (Didn't I hear something about them getting to go out and play with other kids but him being held hostage to practice? Unsure.) Also, after Michael went solo and the Jacksons fell away, they fell into separate lives where his became even more pressured and sensationalized. They grew to achieve some degree of normalcy as their lives changed. Michael's just became more and more abnormal, and in turn, so did he.

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I find this thread, and Michaels's death unsettling. I do not know if he was a pedofile or just different but beautiful man. I don't know a lot of things as I am sure neither do you who are reading this post.

What do I know? I know:

1. He was tremendously gifted as a singer, dancer, song writer...arguably in the top 3-5 musical talents of the last 50 years whether or not you like his music. He has more number one hits than most artists have top 100 hits.

2. There's probably no one in Hollywood I respect more than Brooke Shields and she thought the world of him.

3. His daughter who spoke at the funeral spoke beautiful and loving of him as a father.

4. It's not nice to speak bad about the dead unless their name is Adolf Hitler or something like that.

5. The world is full of people who judge with no facts.

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Hindsight is oftentimes worthless but I think the vast majority of people don't want to insult him. I think they feel horrible for him and that he became a product of an industry that uses human beings up for profit. <Smile> But then again I may only be speaking for myself and some of the family/friends I've spoken to during this ordeal. I think you bring up positive, valid points, Tommy.

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Yes, Tommy your points are very well stated (as usual) in addition to being exceptionally valid. What was going on here is called "whistling while you walk through a cemetary". Meaning that no one is trying to be mean, just trying to put a funny spin on something that is unberably unplesant. I know I felt badly for him and worse for the "media circus travesty" that is ramping up relative to custody of his children and the final disposition of his estate.

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Guest Fresh

After all has been considered, if there was no Joe Jackson,there would have been no Jackson Five,and consequently,no Michael Jackson.Any person or family group that makes it to the top does it through hard work of the highest intensity.Maybe Joe ran the rehearsals with his belt in his hands,but the results were absolutely phenomenal.There are costs for every great achievement in life,and the higher the achievement,the greater the cost.Once MJ was an adult(either 18 or 21),he was free to leave his fathers influence and do whatever it was he desired.He collaberated with Quincy Jones and became a bigger star than he ever was with his father.Did Quincy Jones beat him with a belt?

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Sorry Tommy. I just can't get over MJ's freakshow personal life. I look at chronological pictures of him from the late 70's to the present. Anybody who would have dozens of plastic surgeries and chemical peels to turn himself from a black man to a white woman, have white children, yearn to sleep with young boys (not young girls and boys, just BOYS!, unless they begged to bring their sister along...) and then declares himself the "King Of Pop"?!? And last, dies a drug addict...This kind of life deserves some discussion pro and con, no matter how talented or how generous you think he was.

And he will "rest in peace" when and only when Al Sharpton has exploited enough publicity and money turning Freakshow's life into a racial issue...What a f--cking sick joke!

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I'm pretty much on the same page with Tony.I never really got over MJ annointing himself the"King of Pop".How pretensious!I really think he was jealous of Elvis and wanted to be like him.That is why I believe he married Lisa Marie.So he could possess Elvis' only child.Funny thing about it is...Lisa Marie is a very fertile woman and has had kids with several men,but she was married to MJ for 2 years and probably never missed a period.I don't think MJ was functionally able to get an erection with a woman,let alone impregnate one.I better stop now.

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My sentiments exactly, Pat. This is hardly the first father who has made unwise choices in spite of having kids. He loved them and they knew that and that in itself is more than some kids will EVER know! The fact that they were willing to tell the entire world that they loved HIM should say enough in itself! I cannot fathom what I would have been like if I had been forced to live his life (which started out in an unnatural way thanks to his father.) And dare I say this, but.... why didn't his 'saintly' mother ever put a stop to the father and this insanity for the sake of her children?!?!

Kathy Lee, I don't know how old you are, or where you grew up, but I'm 55, and I can tell you without a doubt that in my childhood years, things were WAY different than they are now. Women didn't leave their abusive husbands. Especially women with children. Especially *black* women with 8 children. It just wasn't done. She was probably afraid she wouldn't be able to support them, and 50 years ago, that fear wasn't far fetched. 50 years ago black people didn't have that many opportunities, and black women with children? Almost nil. Maybe he threatened her, told her he'd kill the kids, we don't know. Many people stay in abusive relationships even today, and today there are far more resources to help an abused spouse start a new life than there were 50 years ago. I don't think she led such a charmed life herself.

But I DO think she should have custody of Michael's kids, she is by far a better example of a good parent than that cursing, yelling, threat wielding b*tch I saw on CNN a few days ago saying she wants custody. I wouldn't give her custody of a junkyard dog.

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Oh, but Julia..while you wax philosophical about the "state of black america" 50 years ago, may I remind you that 50 years ago many, many minority women worked outside of the home (think about Rosa Parks - she wasn't riding the bus just for fun). Julia, please don't play the "race card". Staying and enabling an abuser knows no race, gender or socio-economic boundaries. It happened then and still happens now!

Kathy Lee's point is that since Katharine was powerless do stop the abuse of her own children by her husband (their father) why would she prevent him from abusing this generation of Jackson kids? As for Debbie Rowe, on what program did you hear her say she was going to seek custody of the kids? Yes, I saw her blow up at the media, but I would give her custody of a junkyard dog. Custody of those kids..no, but a junkyard dog yes!! They seem to share the same temperment!

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Minority women worked, yes. Working is a whole different ballgame than leaving a husband with 8 kids in tow and no money. You play your cards, I'll play mine, you can't judge her by today's standards, they didn't exist. And there were DAMN few Rosa Parks, if there had been many, she wouldn't be so famous now, would she?

Why would she stop Joseph now? Maybe because they haven't lived together for over 10 years?

I don't know what show, all I know is it was CNN. She said she *might* seek custody.

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Oh Julia... DAMN few Rosa Parks?? Here is the homework you did not do..

The Montgomery Bus Boycott officially started on December 1, 1955. That was the day when the blacks of Montgomery, Alabama, decided that they would boycott the city buses until they could sit anywhere they wanted, instead of being relegated to the back when a white boarded. It was not, however, the day that the movement to desegregate the buses started. Perhaps the movement started on the day in 1943 when a black seamstress named Rosa Parks paid her bus fare and then watched the bus drive off as she tried to re-enter through the rear door, as the driver had told her to do. Perhaps the movement started on the day in 1949 when a black professor Jo Ann Robinson absentmindedly sat at the front of a nearly empty bus, then ran off in tears when the bus driver screamed at her for doing so. Perhaps the movement started on the day in the early 1950s when a black pastor named Vernon Johns tried to get other blacks to leave a bus in protest after he was forced to give up his seat to a white man, only to have them tell him, "You ought to knowed better." [2] The story of the Montgomery Bus Boycott is often told as a simple, happy tale of the "little people" triumphing over the seemingly insurmountable forces of evil. The truth is a little less romantic and a little more complex.

The simple version of the story leaves out some very important people, such as Jo Ann Robinson, of whom Martin Luther King, Jr., would later write, "Apparently indefatigable, she, perhaps more than any other person, was active on every level of the protest." [3] She was an educated woman, a professor at the all-black Alabama State College, and a member of the Women's Political Council in Montgomery. After her traumatic experience on the bus in 1949, she tried to start a protest but was shocked when other Women's Political Council members brushed off the incident as "a fact of life in Montgomery." After the Supreme Court's Brown decision in 1954, she wrote a letter to the mayor of Montgomery, W.A. Gayle, saying that "there has been talk from 25 or more local organizations of planning a city-wide boycott of buses." By 1955, the Women's Political Council had plans for just such a boycott. Community leaders were just waiting for the right person to be arrested, a person who would anger the black community into action, who would agree to test the segregation laws in court, and who, most importantly, was "above reproach." When fifteen year old Claudette Colvin was arrested early in 1955 for refusing to give up her seat, E.D. Nixon of the NAACP thought he had found the perfect person, but Colvin turned out to be pregnant. Nixon later explained, "I had to be sure that I had somebody I could win with." [4] Enter Rosa Parks.

Rosa Parks is probably the most romanticized personage in the Montgomery cast of characters. She is often portrayed as a simple seamstress who, exhausted after a long day at work, refused to give up her seat to a white person. While this is not untrue, there is more to the story. Parks was educated; she had attended the laboratory school at Alabama State College because there was no high school for blacks in Montgomery at that time, but had decided to become a seamstress because she could not find a job to suit her skills. She was also a long-time NAACP worker who had taken a special interest in Claudette Colvin's case. When she was arrested in December 1955, she had recently completed a workshop on race relations at the Highlander Folk School in Monteagle, Tennessee. And she was a well-respected woman with a spotless record.

Rosa was the most well known, but by no means the first or the only! Bad judgement is still bad judgement in 2009 or 1959. Now you know why Rosa if famous.

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