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DEBATE # 2 OBAMA VS. MCCAIN


Tony Cartmill

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smells like a coupla guys around here still flying the banner for the House Committee on Unethical American Activities or somesuch..

Tony, other than the fact that we are (relentlessly) held hostage to taxes, please tell us how Socialism has its wrenching, unforgiving, non-capitalist grip on your day-to-day life here in the good ol' USA

leave out the reg gov't stuff like imminent domain land grabs, necessary regulations, etc, & describe how Big Brother is dictating your every move - no science fiction please!

or does it all just come pouring down once Obama gets in office?

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the unethical, weasley Palin stuff just keeps pouring out, & much of it is not getting reported at the mainstream/headline level. there's been one after another, incl..

"The fires of hell are frozen glaciers compared to my hatred for the American government. ... And I won't be buried under their damn flag." - founder of secessionist Alaskan Independence Party, which Palin has repeatedly & actively courted, & of which hubby Todd was a long-standing member

get the word out, the Palins are America-haters!!!

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Here's another bit of bad Palin press (stop me if you've heard this one!):

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics...s_makeup_f.html

The Repubs spent how much on clothing and accessories for Sarah and family since September? $150,000? Really?

Well, you can't go around blasting "big government" and frivolous spending and promising to cut out the fat --- and then spend such a big wad on a clothing allowance! For the whole family! Well, she is an attractive woman who wants to look nice, and obviously the Republican machine wanted her to look "just so." But $150,000? I can see $10,000 or $20,000 or $30,000, but... $150,000?

(I like the quick cover-up: "Oh, yeah, well, all along we were planning to drop the clothes into a charity bin after the election....")

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as we know, the Repub party is the party of the rich elite, out of touch w/ struggling middle-class americans - why would this clothing allowance come as a surprise? palin is all eye-candy, no substance; & i think cindy mccain's convention dress cost twice that amt!

people are finally waking up to the fact that the repub party has looked out for the super-rich, & no one else. this is part of the reason (in addition to people's "no way, not even close to being qualified" aversion to palin) that the mccain camp is hemorrhaging more voters every day

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as we know, the Repub party is the party of the rich elite, out of touch w/ struggling middle-classs americans - why would this clothing allowance come as a surprise? palin is all eye-candy, no substance; & i think cindy mccain's convention dress cost twice that amt!

Exactly. I would have sent her to TJ Maxx and then left the tags on her outfits for the whole world to see! hahahaha
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Well, let's see, that socialistic program called SOCIAL SECURITY, that had a promised reserve set up originally, AND ALL OF IT HAS BEEN "BORROWED/STOLEN" BY THE GUB-MENT FOR OTHER PROGRAMS...

And let's see, that other socialistic program called MEDICARE is...BILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN THE RED BECAUSE IT IS RUN BY THE GUB-MENT!

And here in "KAULIFORNIA" MEDI-CAL, our state's socialized Medicare is MILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN DEBT, PAYING OUT 15-20% IN FRAUDULENT CLAIMS, AND HELPING BANKRUPT THE STATE!

And let's see, that Gub-ment sponsored and guaranteed Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac that was pressured by the Gub-ment to socialistically guarantee all those risky loans...WAS THE TRIGGER POINT TO THE CURRENT FINANCIAL CRISIS!

But I did get that $1500 check from the Gub-ment for that stimulus package...

So, Socialism isn't all bad... :rolleyes:

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Inteview from this morning's Chicago Tribune:

Reporter:

Governor Palin, how do you square your common folk approach to the Republican National Committee allocating $150,000 for new clothes for you? These are bad economic times, many Americans homes arent worth that much in depressed, working class areas.

Palin: You betcha. But Im on television alot these days Joe and I cant be seen in a Vancouver Canucks sweatshirt and jogging pants. The kinds of things I wore as Governor arent going to cut it. You have to be hot on T.V these days and as a former Miss Alaska Im in tune with that there sort of thing. I assure you all these monies spent on new clothes will be spent at places like Wallmart and Target where Bob the construction worker and his beer swilling buddies all shop. No fancy New York 5th avenue luxury shops for me I can assure you.

Reporter: What about Senator McCain?

Palin: He feels the same way I can assure you there. If he sold eleven of his cars and 8 of his homes hed be in the same spot as Joe the Plumber. He understands the problems of the average guy, he wasnt always married to a milionairess you know. His first wife worked in a grocery store.

Reporter: Governor, today you called Barack Obama a socialist and anti-American. Do you truly believe that, it seems ludicrous?

Palin: Well, if the shoe fits ya gotta just wear it there bud. And I know alot about shoes. If Obama is elected he plans on taking money from folks like Donald Trump and Warren Bufett and spending those tax dollars on soup kitchens for the unemployed. Now where I come from we call that Socialism of the highest order and theres nothing American about a free lunch, even if its only soup.

Reporter: Dont you and John McCain regret tactics of fear and character assasination in order to try to win this election? Isnt it more important in these difficult times to stick to the issues at hand?

Palin: Well, as Abraham Lincoln said theres nothing to fear but fear itself and maybe immigramts crossing the Texas border. I know alot of these issues , Ive spent alot of time being prepared the past three weeks and I am confident that Obamas health plan will not cover flu shots or even band aids or a nanny. He wants the government to take over health care so that your husband or boyfriend will have to visit your State Senator to get a perscription for viagra. Ive studied the details, I know the policies Bub. Finally,let me say this, this Wall Stret bail out will trickle down to all Americans. Thats why we dont need easier access to your dwindling 401 K funds, emergency mortgage relief, longer unemployment benefits, or any of those screwball commie ideas. The banks and lenders and investment companies, once that there credit is all freed up, why all this will be passed direclty onto the average American without delay. Its the Republican way!

Reptorter: Governor, what about Iraq how long can this go on draining the economy, draining the lives of young soldiers?

Palin: Well, its been awhile for sure but Im confident we will find Bin Laden hiding somewhere in Bhagdad, just like that ole wiley Sadam Hussein. Did you know Obamas middle name is Hussein. Coincidence?,I think not there matey.

And really whats a couple trillion dollars and 5,000 lives if those Iraqui people are free. Free one day to shop, and watch television and work those oil fields to help limit our dependence on Mid-East oil. It will all work out, what's the rush?

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My parents are Republicans!, they wouldnt like Berkeley. Speaking of which, two errors of grammar in your post. But I am always interested in how many of the fundamentalist right have acquired their opinions/positions/beliefs from their early upbringings. Its a good example of brainwashing all things considered.

Its always easier to accept things unquestionably and early indoctrination tends to affect and limit circumspection. I always find that those reared in conservative right wing fundamentalist tendencies have a hard time thinking about issues in alot of details. Bush and Cheney are good examples of this. Because exploring in detail equates with vulnerability in their steadfast positions and its more comfortable to accept them at face value or in simplistic terms.

Because such a consideration illuminates weakness in their argumentation, and questions their pervading sense of "being in the right."

And usually there are great paradoxes: Its patriotic to free Iraq and somehow simultaneosly patriotic to wire tap and torture. Its only by adhering to overiding beliefs such as "I am right," that allows someone to hold such disparate activities as equally good.

Interesting how often Jesus has gotten invoked into this far right discussion in the U.S., and if you read his words in the New Testament its easy to imagine how disgusted he would be by the falseness of it all. Sorta like tipping over the tables of the shopkeepers in the temple.

Such is the dilemma of the far right. Fortunately they cant see their own hypocrisy since they are too busy in a prevailing sense of being right. But its clear where America is today and that 8 years of these political philosophies, agendas, actions, expense has left us in a very bad place.

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Your post, particularly the last paragraph is total hypocrisy...it's very amusing. My Grandfather was Hugh DeLacy,a socialist congressman representing the Seattle area. My father was a life long union steward, always voted for Democrats. So much for your theory.

You should have used the word argument, instead of argumentation.I had to take remedial english as a freshmen in college.

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Glad you find it interesting, I see you decided to change your mind about not addressing my posts. I didnt say this occured in every case just that Ive seen it in many cases. You seem to be an exception, an anomaly, you must have wandered into your world of delusion and sense of being in the right through other means. Must be the Rush Limbaugh radio shows. Glad to see your an English scholar, I certainly wouldnt know it from your posts.

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