WANNAMAN Posted February 16, 2005 Share Posted February 16, 2005 With all the press and the recent best selling book from Jose Canseco on the subject of Heavy Steroids use throughout baseball... I was wondering what everyone opinion of our national pastime is?Should all the players admiting to using the stuff be allowed in the HOF?Are the baseball cards from the 1980's to the present mostly worthless?Is it fair that Jose be treated like a criminal and Jason Giambi be forgiven? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy K. Posted February 16, 2005 Share Posted February 16, 2005 Seems like Canseco comes of as a bit of self-serving, by putting this book out.You think with Ken Caminiti, a big steroid user, dying recently, this would be a wake-up call. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marvin Posted February 16, 2005 Share Posted February 16, 2005 I find it ironic that McGwire got out of baseball just when the scandal was making the front pages. Marvin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WANNAMAN Posted February 16, 2005 Author Share Posted February 16, 2005 Anyone still going to go to the games or watch it on tv?? This is not a good thing for the game and had dropped the game in my priority list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marvin Posted February 16, 2005 Share Posted February 16, 2005 No MLB games in my area, but I'll still watch. Of course I've even lost my beloved Expos.Marvin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougjack Posted February 16, 2005 Share Posted February 16, 2005 We used to go to games (Indians) every year, but between the steroids, the management selling off every good player (or rather any player whose contract was getting the least bit expensive) while charging $7 for a hot dog, and the players just out for whoever pays the most (say it ain't so, Jim Thome), it's hard to know what we'd be rooting for.Right now, my attitude is that you should throw out the records of anyone who can be proven to have used steroids. No HOF. It's not fair to those who played by the rules. If McGuire, Sosa and Bonds all used, then Roger Maris is still the single-season home run king. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted February 17, 2005 Share Posted February 17, 2005 The crime is that Baseball knowingly let it happen. We'll never have a fully inclusive list of who took steroids and thus never be able to look at statistics and records set over the last 20 or whatever years with any degree of confidence that these statistics/records are authentic.I had boycotted the game for some years for some of its other BS (see Baseball thread) but decided to get back into it last season....am re-thinking this now.It's unforgivable that nobody had the balls to step in at the beginning and nip this steroid thing in the butt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy K. Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 Marvin, I would have to agree with you. McGwire was starting to physically look a bit different at that point....and pretty much the same as the differences in Barry Bonds'.My own personal experience with steroids was for medicinal purposes, to encourage healing. This was following eye surgery. The first couple of weeks I had to have them 4x/day. Then it would go to 2x/day....but then if it appears that you are not healing, then you go back to the 4x dosage.If you appear to be healing, then to once a day, for a week then every other day. Even though these were in eye drop form, I still felt a bit dehydrated after using these steroids, and was glad to get off of them relatively quickly.And technically, cortisone, which is used to help injured joints is actually a steroid. So there are some legitimate uses for these things. And knowing some patients that have gone into treatment for injuries also have puffy looking faces after taking cortisone. With this in mind, I really find it hard to believe that Barry Bonds "doesn't" use steroids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darlene Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 I tore my left rotator cuff at work, developed frozen shoulder and had to have cortisone shots in my shoulder and three months of therapy or they said I'd never play the violin again. Cortisone kicks like a mule going in, and I can imagine that prolonged use is dangerous. It gave me mobility, but I hope I never have to get another shot again. As for the whole steroids thing, I think it's so sad. Guys who broke records honorably shouldn't have theirs topped dishonestly. The whole thing hasn't done the sport any good, and casts aspersions, or at least doubt, on innocent players who do exceptionally well. Everyone will always wonder, unless the "powers that be" clean things up. --D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Benfer Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 McGuire is of course denying use of steroids, and I'm not going to presume guilt without any facts to back it up. There is no doubt that his body took on the look of steroid use, but there are many other enhancement supplements along with hard work in the weight room that can do the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darlene Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 Once again, Craig, you're so sane and reasonable!Like I said, LOVE your posts! --D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 Mcguire admitted using an over the counter product called androstine which is basically a legal steroid.Many of the muscle heads at the gym I used to go to used androstine and they would always say that it was justas good as steroids for muscle recovery and growth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trindy Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 But from what I hear McGwire was seen using something that isn't even available in Canada...You know what is scary? How little baseball and many of its fans seem to care. It's like, "OK, they were juiced, but hey, isn't it exciting watching those juiced-up guys go for all those hits?" It is all about entertainment value in their eyes. To hell with sport.I thought I couldn't get more revulsed than I was after hearing excerpts of Canseco's book being read on TV...in which he described how steroids shrink your testicles but make your penis bigger (is it only by comparison? LOL!), but I think the columnist Maureen Dowd just did it today. She wrote about this habit ballplayers have, when they get into a slump, of deliberately bedding the ugliest woman they can find...it's supposed to be good luck...they refer to these women as "slump busters." Lovely. So some Baseball Annie who maybe isn't so thin or pretty thinks she's really accomplished something when you want to take her to bed...and the truth is, you're only doing it BECAUSE you think she's a hag...It's enough to make me really, really revulsed. Sheesh, first we in Cleveland lose Omar Vizquel (one of the few genuine nice guys in baseball) when he becomes a free agent, severing our last tie with the glory days when the Indians were in the Series. And now this ugly stuff comes along to disillusion us further. Some fun. *snort* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marvin Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 Trindy keep the faith: the Indians will be in the running for the Central Division crown.Marvin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiggsherby Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 ...people have been doing things to get an "edge" in every sport for years. Do ya think steroids never happened in any of the other sports? Baseball will clean things up now that it's out. You can put an * next to a lot of records for various reasons, where would it stop?The Fightin' Phils are going to surprise everyone this year...they win the division and then probably lose in the first round of the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ann Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 I'm definitely not in favor of steriods. But I still love baseball. From T-Ball all the way to the Majors!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trindy Posted February 27, 2005 Share Posted February 27, 2005 Tiggsherby, the point isn't whether steroids ever happened in any other sport or not (and I'm not some innocent, I know they have). The point is whether ANYONE should be using them in ANY sport. And I lack your faith that baseball will "clean things up now that it's out." Not if it will kill the golden goose or they think it might, it won't.Marvin, I wish I was as convinced as you that the Tribe will be contending for the AL Central this season. I don't think they're willing to spend the money they really need to contend, and as long as they're owned by penny-pinchers we will not see the likes of '95 or '97 again. Which is sad, because if they did contend again, and won another pennant and made it back to the World Series, maybe a certain four guys could sing the national anthem at one of the Jacobs Field games...(Hey, I'm still annoyed that they asked Joe Walsh to sing last time, but never asked Eric--who at least is a baseball fan! Darn, that would be a good question for "Ask Eric"--how much baseball memorabilia does he have?)I'm just glad I got to see Omar Vizquel's laast game as an Indian. It so happened that my employer had a luxury box for that day and I was invited to join in. Very emotional moment...every single at-bat, and when he came to what everyone knew might be his last, everyone was on their feet for him. There was a guy who, while not a native, was loyal to the city for so long and would gladly have stayed around if it had been possible to work a free agent deal. He was a team guy without the usual ballplayer ego, and everyone loved him. To watch him play--to see him field all those balls barehanded and backhanded and zing 'em right to wherever he wanted them, sometimes while still in midair, was to watch a master at work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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