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The NFL '08 Thread


LC

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Here are your Bears' starting QBs in the 16 years that Favre started every game for GB (1992-2007). Count 'em: 21 of 'em! (Who's doing the Bears' scouting for QBs?)

Jim Harbaugh

Will Furrer (wasn't he on Hogan's Heroes for a while?)

Peter Tom Willis (good QBs don't need two first names)

Steve Walsh

Erik Kramer

Dave Krieg

Rick Mirer (0-3 as a starter, 0 TDs, 6 INTs in 1997)

Steve Stenstrom (sold seashells by the seashore)

Moses Moreno (18-41 in his only start, 1998)

Shane Matthews

Cade McNown (1st-round pick, 1999; 3-12 as a starter in '99 and '00)

Jim Miller

Chris Chandler

Henry Burris (18-51 in 2002!)

Kordell Stewart

Chad Hutchinson (1-4 as a starter, 2004)

Craig Krenzel (3-2 as a starter in 2004)

Jonathan Quinn (former Jag was 0-3 as a Bear starter, 2004)

Brian Griese

Rex Grossman

Kyle Orton (probably their best QB since Harbaugh! Or maybe their "least bad QB" since Harbaugh...)

Our disagreement over Favre's integrity aside, let's go back to that Bears QB list for a moment. Seriously... do you and other Bears fans (BHPat? CubFanMike?) see a problem with the team's QB selection? Perhaps it should be more of a priority. Just a thought. I was really intrigued by the list once I started compiling it....
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BTW, I'm not making fun of da Bears.... The Packers had the same issue between Bart Starr and Brett Favre, although Lynn Dickey was pretty good. Otherwise:

Scott Hunter (took over when Bart retired)

Jerry Tagge (rag-armed QB, but rugged runner)

Jim Del Gaizo (lefty; completed 27 of 62 passes for GB, 1973)

John Hadl (played with the Pack near the end of a pretty good career; he had 33,503 yards and 244 TD passes, mostly for San Diego)

Jack Concannon (Bear castoff who also played for GB near the end of his career; 0-2 as a Packer starter, 1974)

Don Milan (his only start was a loss to Chicago, 1975)

Carlos Brown (completed just 29 of 78 passes, 37%, as a Packer, but... he had his own football card!)

Randy Johnson (won his only start as a Packer, 1975, beating Falcons, his former team)

Lynn Dickey (was pretty darned good -- stabilized the position from 1976-1985, throwing 32 TD passes in 1983 and 25 the next year)

Randy Wright (was 7-25 as a Packer starter, 1984-88)

Jim Zorn (former Seahawk)

Vince Ferragamo (didn't actually start a game, but I had to include him for posterity)

David Whitehurst

Don Majkowski (the Majik Man!)

Alan Risher (I honestly forgot him; an LSU grad who had a 2-1 record as a Packer starter, 1987)

Anthony Dilweg

Blair Kiel

Mike Tomczak (Bears castoff)

That's 17 starters between 1972-1992... and just 1 between 1992-2007. Not bad!

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LC - While Favre is, to date, something like 22-10 against the Bears, we need to remember that most of his career was played against less-than-stellar coaches in Chicago, as well as horrible QBs. (Wannstedt, Jauron, etc.) I believe Mike Ditka went something like 14-4 against GB prior to Favre's arrival, and 1-1 after it (his coaching career in Chicago overlapped 1 year into Brett's playing career with GB).....and most years, both teams had pretty bad QBs, except when McMahon was healthy (and hot getting mugged by the likes of Charles Martin). I believe Chicago is something like 90-79-6 overall against GB......In the overall scheme of things, each team goes thru good spells and bad ones.

Yes, the Bears should draft a decent QB once in awhile....the problem generally is their coach (whoever he may be) can't see past the running game and defense....which they live and/or die by.

While I'm not crazy about what the Packers' mgmt did to BF, I tend to agree with James that no one player is bigger than the team!....at least not to the point that I'd ever switch allegiance to another team if my favorite team screwed over a player or coach or manager (see NY Yankees, Joe Torre prior to this past season).

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Yep, ups and downs for all franchises.... I remember that Charles Martin body slam---that was pure "thug" action. He never amounted to much. At least the Packers helped McMahon get one more ring, the year he backed up Favre. But what a nasty play that was on Martin's part.

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While I'm not crazy about what the Packers' mgmt did to BF, I tend to agree with James that no one player is bigger than the team!....at least not to the point that I'd ever switch allegiance to another team if my favorite team screwed over a player or coach or manager (see NY Yankees, Joe Torre prior to this past season).

No question that no one player is bigger than the team. At the same time, there are certain cases where a franchise has to show respect, and I don't think the Packers did that. Unless it's the $25 million "stay-retired" bribe. Or the promise that he could come to camp and compete for his old job. Plain and simple: The Three Stooges, er, Packer managment wanted to move on, and it was impossible to do so without alienating a lot of fans.

You had to have been there, JohnO, when the Packers sucked, and stumbled through just about 30 years without even a hint of the Super Bowl. It's the "Lombardi Trophy," for heaven's sake, and we were never a threat to hoist it between Super Bowl II and Super Bowl XXXI. Favre was a key to the turnaround, and for 16 years, he was this great constant on a team and in a league where everything changes every year. Players' careers last four or five years if they're lucky. After 16 years, to still play at that level, Favre is almost a freak of nature. And it just wasn't right to end his time in GB that way. That's just how I feel.

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One last thing on fandom, JohnO: I wouldn't say I've switched my allegiance. Well, okay, maybe I have, because I love watching the Jets, while watching the Packers isn't such a thrill, sad to say, like it always has been.

"Fandom" is a very emotional thing, as you know. I can't help it that I lived and died with EVERY down the Packers played between Super Bowl II and last January, when Favre threw that errant pass vs. the Giants. I have bled green and gold.... (I once jumped out of my chair, when James Lofton scored a 60-yard end-around TD vs. Dallas in a playoff game in 1983, and put my hand through a light fixture. Even though I got cut up and was bleeding, I didn't care.)

Likewise, I can't help it if I don't "live or die" on every down of Packer games now. It's not that I want 'em to lose; it's just less of a "story" for me anymore. It's more a reflection of being disappointed at Packer management. The so-called Three Stoogers came in around three or four years ago; they didn't have a "connection" to the franchise, they didn't have years of passion invested in the Green Bay Packers. They got powerful jobs with the team and they set out to get us back to the Super Bowl. And no doubt they've made some excellent moves, as we saw last year. But somehow, it's just not the same. It's probably the way I'd feel if I saw Raspberries play w/out Eric or Wally.... I'd root for 'em, but it's just different.

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Tony... I remember back in the early days of the Pads... manager Preston Gomez not once... but twice pinch hit for Clay Kirby when Kirby had a no hitter through 8 innings... because both times they were down 1 - 0... and both times the pinch hitter failed, the new pitcher gave up a hit... at least... and both times the Padres lost the game... and Kirby never did get a no-hitter... not with the Pads or later, when he was with the Reds... frown

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Getting back to Brett Favre and the "prima donna" issue.... That phrase actually came up in a story published today by the NY Post. An excerpt:

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... Favre didn't come into this situation exuding an iota of his stature. "Favre is one of the most down-to-earth guys you'll meet," Jets NT Kris Jenkins said. "A lot of people might think that, because the fame and notoriety [a player like Favre has], they might be [full of] themselves. Favre is like the furthest from that."

Tight end Chris Baker said he was curious about "what makes him tick, what makes him enjoy the game so, so much."

"He's been what you expect and more. He's not a prima donna, look-at-me type. He just goes out and has fun. What he's done is really be himself."

------------------------------------------

Here's the whole story: Favre in NY

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On another note, did you football fans catch the Steelers' re-signing of Najeh Davenport? He's not a bad guy to call in, having run for around 500 yards for Pittsburgh last year. With three injured RBs this year, they need him. They just have to keep him away from their laundry..... Najeh will forever be followed by the story of how, in 2002, while with the Packers, he, um, sat down in a woman's laundry basket in her dorm-room closet and deposited a load of... well, I'll let you read the story, if you've never heard it:

DAVENPORT IN A LOAD OF TROUBLE

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I thought the same thing, Billy. Davenport is an absolute bull, a load to bring down. And he's actually a pretty good receiver out of the backfield. I thought GB could have used him last year, up until Grant had his breakout game(s).

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